Death by Acupuncture

In 2004 I was hit in the solar plexus numerous times with  a sharp object (while I was passed out). Trying to figure out what this demented person intended to do, I  found information on deadly strikes and Marcial Arts.  It found that if you have a burning sensation after you get hit in the solar plexus, you were hit in the deadly point, and you die in seven years.  Indeed I recall feeling a strong sensation of burning.  What do yo know abou this.  Is this diagnosis/prognosis true? You die of what?   Please let me know if you ever find anything about what kind of illness, organ failure occurs in this. Is there anything one can do about it?

Thank you, I appreciate

Elena


Comments

Chad Dupuis's picture

Do you still have pain in the

Do you still have pain in the area or has it since passed?  If it has passed, I wouldn't worry about it and if it hasn't I would see an acupuncturist - ideally one who is also a martial artist.  Certainly there is a system of pressure point fighting called dim mak but very few people really understand it.  There are historical accounts of fighters being able to strike certain acupuncture points and cause internal damage - often resulting in "unexplained" death (or serious illness) days, months and in some cases years after the strike.  Most of the many months/years later is largely folklore in my opinion but it is possible with a tremendous amount of serious training to learn enough to cause internal damage to organs which may not show up for days maybe weeks later.  That said, while this is a popular topic to study very few people have enough control over this to accomplish much of anything.

The burning sensation was more than likely just soft tissue damage which would be expected in a situation like that.  If it has passed rest easily and be sure to write us again after the 7 year mark has passed....

Elena Marcus's picture

Hello Chad, Thanks a lot

Hello Chad,

Thanks a lot for answering.  It certainly made me feel better.  I will look for an acupuncturist who is a martial artist. This insane woman, my ex-landlord, is not a martial artist, she's just a sadistic woman who watches murder mystery movies and wants to put them in practice.   I don't have any pain in the solar plexus. This 7-year exact date is daunting .  I know after this I have had issues with the immune and digestive systems that I didn't have before, and adrenal fatigue, but I dont' really feel like I am dying next year in September.

Thanks again,

Elena

carlhendel's picture

deadly points, myths and truths

Yes, there are these "secret" deadly points.  They can have profound physiologic effect when stimulating them.  The is much magic and belief around this subject.  Killer martial artists usually were very focused when directing their qi through their bodies into the vicim's body.  Even an angry crazy person with no skill could really hurt you by smashing your neck, breaking your voicebox, being struck in the belly and more.

Let's not make more of too much of this, though.  Magic and myth and legend happen.  Everybody, including fighters and martial artists die.  Those engaged in such activites were certainly living a dangerous lifestyle.  So, statistics, which can make even our current day scientific data say pretty much anything, could certainly make a claim that the "7 years" is a scecial number. 

My advice.... understand that that belief might be flawed. Talk with your doctor to be sure his exam of your abdomen is normal.  If it is, look for other reasons for your digestive and immune problems, such as stress and emotional tensions.  Live an active, strtress-managed life, and the 7 years will have no power.

Kuma's picture

Death by Acupuncture

Let me comment as a martial artist who has been studying "death touch" martial arts for a couple of decades. Yes, it is possible to cause death after a delay of several days through martial arts techniques. There are probably fewer than 1,000 martial artists in the world with the skill and knowledge to do this effectively.

That said, it cannot be done with one strike or touch, or even a series of strikes and/or touches to the same point. It requires that several points be struck, rubbed or squeezed, in the proper order and at the proper angle, and at the proper time of day. Chances of it being accomplished accidentally -- or by an amateur -- are ridiculously low. None of these points are on the solar plexus.

Also, I have never heard of anyone with any credibility claiming a delay of years is possible, and even months is a stretch. Shock your cardiac system so you'll die of "sponateous" heart failure in a few days? No problemo! Cause you to die next year by what I do today? To the best of my knowledge, it can't be done.
 

Elena Marcus's picture

Cold in lower back and hyper

Thank you Kuma for your feedback on deadly acupuncture.  I really appreciate your time. 

Does anyone know what deficiency one has when one feels cold in the lower back.  Is this yin or yang deficiency?   Am I supposed to strenghten my yin or my yang?  What herbal supplement I can get? I cannot tolerate cold weather anylonger.  I am not tired, I am hyperactive but my mind is not focused. I need to be more focused and optimistic mentally. Can anyone help?

 

Elena

Chad Dupuis's picture

You should consult directly

You should consult directly with an acupuncturist.  While it may seem simple enough to describe a few symptoms and see what people think, this is not at all how Chinese Medicine works.  Someone who can discuss your entire medical history and perform a physical exam (tongue, pulse, etc.) can come up with a clear diagnosis.  Everything else is just conjecture.  Many people have mixed symptoms that take time and sometimes even treatment before a very clear underlying pattern is obvious.  For example, generally speaking cold in the lower back is Kidney Yang Deficiency and hyperactivity is Kidney Yin Deficiency.  Generally speaking one is the root and some of the other symptoms are secondary.  If you try to treat both you generally don't get very far and if you do not clearly distinguish the root you may help somewhat but will not get a deep resolution.  Only a practitioner who can physically work with you can answer these questions with any degree of accuracy.

Elena Marcus's picture

Thank you Chad, this is

Thank you Chad, this is helpful. Of course, you are right about the diagnosis. I am not able to see an acupuncturist but perhaps a general kidney tonic may help. There could also be a root in a totally different area, I guess (but I've been hyper since I was 3)   I will go to a TCM herbalist who knows pulse diagnosis.

Thank you,

Elena

 

Chad Dupuis's picture

A TCM herbalist should be

A TCM herbalist should be fine.  I usually use the word "acupuncturist" generally to refer to what are often technically Doctors of Chinese Medicine.  Meaning they practice acupuncture, herbal medicine, tuina, moxibustion, etc. - the whole gamut of Chinese Medicine techniques.  An herbalist in the shop should be able to help you.  There may be some experimentation like I stated in mixed syndromes even with a good read on what is happening.  In some cases you have to clear a little of the heat (the restlessness, etc.), then build a little energy, then clear, etc. until things even out - again a very simplified generalization, but you get the idea.  I wish you the best.

Elena Marcus's picture

Cold back - is ginseng only for men?

Chad, is ginseng only for men?  I recall I read somewhere that women should not take it.  Is this true?

Thank you,

Elena Marcus

Chad Dupuis's picture

No women can most certainly

No women can most certainly use ginseng as well.  It's in many of the chinese tonic formulas.  It is best when it is used within an appropriately designed formula such as Ren Shen Shou Wu Wan, just as an example (it's in many others).  This opposed to using OTC single herb formulas that show up in vitamin shops and other natural health stores which can be too strong and even dangerous if taken by the wrong person.  In short, formulas are generally much safer than individual herbs (which are not often used in Chinese Medicine). 

Elena Marcus's picture

Formulas in TCM

Thank you Chad  for your response. 

In principle, if I see a formula,  and a range of symptoms are described, and I have 80 percent of the symptoms, but I don't have 20 percent of them,would it be dangerous to take such a formula? 

Thank you,

Elena

Chad Dupuis's picture

Of course it is not ideal to

Of course it is not ideal to self medicate with herbal formulas - generally.  While they are natural substances they still are quite strong and used incorrectly can cause just as many problems as western medicines, if not more.  The upside to Chinese Herbal Formulas, particularly in the standardized formulas that we offer (opposed to mixing raw herbs - or taking single herbal extracts as are popular in health stores) is that the formulas themselves are well tested and in most cases quite old - many hundreds of years old in many cases.  While not ideal, some are pretty straightforward and so widely used that you can at least try the formula without being overly concerned about problems.  Many of the formulas for standard conditions, colds/flus, allergies, PMS, anxiety, insomnia, etc. are on the clear and reliable side of the equation.  Most of what we offer within our store in particular are what we consider to be safe formulas that can be tried if they seem to fit symptoms.  We, of course, recommend and prefer that people at least consult with a practitioner locally but realize that this can be difficult in certain areas and financially in cases.  

There are other formulas that are used by Chinese herbalists that we don't offer openly to the public because they may say they are used for one thing but have a broad range of uses or can be completely wrong for some people with that same condition (that is they have a different underlying pattern in TCM terms).  On our site at least we don't offer formulas that we feel can be unsafe if improperly used.

Blade's picture

Death by Acupuncture

Elena, from your description I feel pretty safe to say you have nothing to worry about. I am one of the lucky very few people who have been introduced to what is called the 'Death Touch' - or Dim Mak in Chinese - in martial arts.. My teacher was a very traditional master who started his studies as a child back in the 30s in monasteries in China, he was the top student of his class later the inheritor of the entire style - what is in martial arts called the 'generation master'.

 

What the person you described above did to you is nothing at all what the art of 'Death Touch' is. Having a 'warm feeling' after being hit is normal for just about any hit to the body, this is the body's normal, natural reaction to physical trauma - trust me I've been hit a few times in my life during my martial arts studies - and also the nature of the hit tells me that it's nothing that would be related to the 'delayed death'.

 

I do however would like to ask you a few questions just to be on the absolute sure side: where EXACTLY were you hit? Was it the dead center of your body or was it to either side - even just half an inch matters!)? If it was to either side, which side and how far off your center? Please be very precise. How far down from your sternum was the hit, can you measure it for me? Did you receive multiple or just a single blow? Sounds like this was also a very hard hit, please confirm that it was a strong hit. What day AND time of the day were you hit (date and what time - around 10 am, noon ... etc.)?

 

Other questions: have you had an X-Ray/CT scan to eliminate any internal injury or bleeding? With a hard blow such as that, I would worry more about an internal injury, not the Death Touch. If you haven't yet, please get one (or both) of the above done to be safe.

 

In conclusion: from your description I feel safe to say that you have nothing to worry about as far as the 'delayed death' goes, this person is just a crazy dangerous person with no skills or knowledge of this art (it is an astronomical chance that some punches without skills would work but in your case even these can be eliminated). Just please answer all of my questions but again, I see no reasons at all for you to worry beyond internal injuries. I also do hope that you have reported this person to the authorities and she is dealt with according to her actions.

 

Blade~

Elena Marcus's picture

Death by Acupuncture

Hello Blade,

Thank you for responding.  The time of the day was somewhere around 8:30 a.m.

I have a photogaph that I can email to you if you wish to see exactly the spots where she hit me.  My email is elena@doghappiness.net.  The sadistic woman hit me over the head, and while i was dizzy she pulled me inside her place (she is twice my size exactly, 200 versus 100 lbs.).  She hit me with a medium size claw hammer on the left side about 1.5 inches or 2 inches from the middle of the solar plexus.  Two marks were on that side.   Another mark was on the right side, much closer to the middle of the solar plexus, about half an inch.  When I came to, she had this claw hammer in her hand.   However, the next day, my chest was peppered with needle marks, the entire area of the solar plexus. These marks lasted for a long time, many months.  Next morning,   I had no voice at all, and I could not move my head right or left for two or three hours hours.  My neck was painful and when I pressed my finger on the jugular vein it was extremely painful.   I didn't get an X-ray of the solar plexus, but they did X-ray of my head and then the nexk, because I had scars and two three concussions around the skull  - closed wounds.

This woman is an engineer by training and she premeditated this in detail.  I believe she trained herself for it.  They didn't do anything to her.  The sheriff deputies thought it was no big deal that someone hits you in the chest with a claw hammer.

Thank you and I appreciate your writing to me,

Elena

 

 

 

Blade's picture

Hi Elena,   Even as

Hi Elena,

 

Even as martial artists I have to say it is just insane what this person did to you and have absolutely no comprehension as to how she is still living a free life and walking amongst people every day. Clearly she is capable of hurting - possibly even killing - someone and I just don't know how the legal system can allow this to happen. Probably going to be the usual case when they only arrest her AFTER she has done some very serious damage or kill someone because clearly she is capable of both.

 

Again, from your further description I see no reason for you to be alarmed, I see no skills in the attacks, no systematical location selections and using the hammer further tells me that this person posesses no skills at all - more like a mad woman going at you with all her will and anger. Sad case in anyway.

 

Yes please send me all photo(s) that show your injuries or any suspicious marks on you, the more you have the better (more often than not clues you think aren't important turn out to be the most important ones). The thing still buffles me here is the 'needle marks' that you mentioned, do you possibly have close ups on these? I am just trying to figure out what she tried to do while you were dazed or passed out? But sounds like you don't remember her having needles anywhere when you regained consciousness? Correct?

 

I will e-mail you soon, please reply there and send me all pictures you have.

 

Again, it is just terrible what has happened to you and I'm glad I could help you out!

 

Blade~

Elena Marcus's picture

Death by Acupuncture

Hello Blade, thank you for your help. I am trying to email you photos in a zip folder.  Please  let me know what do you think.

She didn't have needles when I came too, she had the claw hammer in her hand.

The claw hammer marks were taken by my boyfriend the same day or next day. The needle marks were very numerous inside the middle of the solar plexus but showed up a little later.  They showed later and lasted many months after the claw hammer marks disappeared.  I know this sadistic woman wanted to do me away without evidence. I hope she didn't succeed.

No, she wasn't prosecuted in spite of all the evidence I sent them - the sheriff deputes and the county prosecutor thought it was no big deal that someone hits you in the solar plexus with a claw hammer.

Blade's picture

Death by Acupuncture - Conclusion

Elena and I discussed this matter, she sent me photos of her injuries as well as detailed description of other marks not presented on the photos. She also told me how the attack took place and when.

 

After examining the marks and reading the descriptions I did not find a single sign that would point this person to have any knowledge of the death touch system or even acupuncture. Neither any of the hammer marks showed any threat or - although no photos were taken - the description of the needle marks pointing to any sign of the attacker having even a basic knowledge of the death touch system. Matter of fact any understanding of acupuncture or any of their underlying laws were completely missing. None of the hammer marks were on any vulnerable points, there were no relations between the front (Yin) and the back (Yang) marks. The forces of the blows were also too violent or hard and also no distinction between the impacts on soft tissues vs. the harder (bony) are of the body. This further displays the attacker having no knowledge using either system .

 

The needle marks: not sure what the attacker tried to accomplish with this, possibly harm by acupuncture? From Elena's description, these again showed no signs of any knowledge from her, the needle marks were spread out and not focused on or close to specific points and even though Japanese acupuncture uses 'around the point' needling, from Elena's description her marks were spread out relatively widely. Also the needle marks showed inconsistency of depth, further showing the lack of knowledge of this attacker.

 

In conclusion her attacker showed no sign of having even the basic, very fundamental knowledge of either Chinese system (martial arts or medicine) therefore I ensured Elena that she is in no danger whatsoever. The attacker knocked her out  giving her all the opportunities to do things the right way but despite of this she still showed not even a single sign of any skill.

 

Blade~

Feng Mei's picture

martial arts point injury

 NNormal hit point can make this area Qi and Blood stag., if it is martial arts point may be broken the energy channel can cause some kind of damage in body energy circle. the easy way to treat is put some pain killer patches on the point to promote Qi and blood movement. 8 hours each day after 7 days the pain will gone. if the energy channel been damaged, you must find martial arts injury acupuncture or tuina master use herb wine to open the channel and points to rebuild the energy channel.

Elena Marcus's picture

Tuina Master and Herb Wine

Thank you Mei for your suggestions, I appreciate it.  Could you please explain what is herb wine in TCM?   Here I can buy alcohol extractions what they call here 'tincture" which are usually approximatively 60% alcohol?

When I consulted a TCM doctor years ago, he gave me herbs, which he advised to be boiled for  20 minutes. As TCM is popular in California,  I do find herb combination tinctures on the market such as Dragon Bone and Blood House but they are still general formulations.

Thank you again,

Feng Mei's picture

herb wine

There are diferent kinds of herb formula wine in TCM treament, in the chinese herb store you can buy the herb wine is the "shao lin temple" made the martial arts injury herb wine, and it

is not for drink only for tuina on the injury location. for cheap treatment you can go to the pharmacy buy the medicine alcohol 70% use for directly tuina on the injury location.

Elena Marcus's picture

Thank you so much, I greatly

Thank you so much, I greatly appreciate your help and getting back to me with the explanations,

Elena

Blade's picture

In case of martial art

In case of martial art points, internal treatment is essential for treatment. This can only be done by using points that neutralize the effect of the deadly points, the effects are not treatable simply by 'generic' herb solutions - it would pretty much be comparable to trying to cure cancer with Tylenol or Aspirin or some generic drug. This system is highly complex and a generic herb would not be effective in neturalizing it.

 

Since there are only a very few people who are actually introduced to this system, it is very highly unlikely that you will ever be hit by one, and let me say from my over two deacades of studies, all the historical records I have read and all the top Chinese masters of their system I knew (thanks to having a generation master as my teacher), these masters are extremely reserved, they would NEVER use this system just on anybody and especially not just from a moment's anger. They are highly skilled masters and fully aware of what this system is reserved for, never compromizing their reputation by using it just from getting angry at a person at a moment. 

 

In Elena's case it was also clearly demonstrated that her attacker does not have even the very basic, fundamental knowledge, she is completely safe. Unfortunately some people read things on the internet or in books or see something in TV/movies and try to mimick them - not knowing how complex this system is and how many years of very hard work, study and dedication required to accomplish this. These impostors then use it to threaten/terrorize people with it - sadly. From my experience in martial arts, these people are always 'weeded out' early even in martial arts school. My master used to say that they do 'mouth kung fu' and they usually never advanced from that 'special level' .... :)

 

So in recapping, by far the best is if you see a martial artist skilled in this system, but since it is extremely hard to find one, your next best choice is to try to find a highly skilled TCM doctor, do not try to cure yourself with some generic herb/medicine solutions!

 

Blade~

Elena Marcus's picture

Thank you again for your

Thank you again for your help.  I think I got rid of my anxiety when I realize how hard it is to hit that particular point. I needdle in the haystack.  I also learned not to take my safety for granted when I read about how you can be rendered unconscious by a single knock on the temple.

Thank you everyone for your advice,

Elena